we go back historically, we remember it was a game changer when president kennedy debated richard nixon. same was true with ronald reagan when he debated jimmy carter. it can make a difference. mitt romney needs to come out and be very aggressive about the president's policies and his solutions. and i think he will do real good. >> we know they've been rehearsing zingers or we're told by a "new york times" report this morning that mitt romney has been practicing zingers. i guess practicing them on some of his aides as well. you just talked about substance. others have been focusing on, well, really it's the moments and the zingers that make the difference. which do you think it is? >> there has to be a sense throughout -- at the end of the debate, the viewer will have a sense as to who can be the better leader for the united states. and mitt romney has to come across as, well, he can do a better job leading the united states on domestic policies. so it's an impression that the viewer will get overall. it will be the zingers. but it will be really the impression. who can create the bette